G3|Genius wrote:
topal63 wrote:
No one is responsible for this death. . . there is NO historical PROOF Jesus ever existed.
There is no archeological evidence either.
NONE.
Anyone that claims there is - is full of it. . . ignorant belief that is.
Do some research, you fool. Don't be blind. The Romans themselves have written documentation of Jesus of Nazareth.
Supply it [the Documentation] smarty-pants Mr. Non-fool - for I know otherwise (I know the FACTS with precision). I am fairly certian that your "belief" of documentation is just that - a belief. A belief that amounts to a misrepresentation of what is really laid down in the archived historical record. There is only proof that a cult was in existence/or emerging around 40-100 AD. Nothing else is evidenced; not the man; but rather a cult assigned a myth and a name.
Here is a little further expansion of the FACTS.
All of the mentions of “Christos in history - form the acknowledgement of a Greek-type mystery-cult existing - nothing more. And all of the mentions of the new-cult appear many decades after the supposed god-man dying myth. And many of those early forms of the new-cult were quite different from what that cult is now. But Jesus; the Christ character; as a man; is a missing figure - from history.
The emergence of the new cult (& the gospels) is historically in line with the digestion of the Hebrew tradition by the Roman elite (trained in Greek). The tradition came into the possession of the Roman Empire at the direct request of the Jews. Being a multi-cultural society the Romans allowed many forms of faith to exist with no regulation of that faith as long as it did not challenge the political authority of the Roman Empire. When great numbers of Jews became Hellenized, the Jewish elite became worried about cultural-religious nihilism and requested the Roman scribes to translate the Hebrew Bible (Jewish myth & practice, gathered and canonized by Ezra as Cryus the ruler of Persia allowed Ezra and followers, in captivity in Babylon, to return to Israel-Judea) the result was the Septuagint about a century and half before the emergence of a new god-man myth. All of the known canonized gospels were written in Greek (not any Semitic-tongue).
The emergence of the new god-man myth is astrologically associated with a prior to Christ god-myth form; the ram (Aries) and this constellation was being replaced as the dominant constellation by the fish (Pisces); and thus a new god.
In 128 B.C.E. the Greek astronomer Hipparchus of Rhodes discovered the precession of the equinoxes.
As the earth's axis slowly shifts its orientation in space, it traces out the surface of a double cone in space. Because of the axial wandering, the points where the celestial equator (the projection of the earth's equator onto the celestial sphere) intersects the ecliptic (the apparent path made by the sun against the background of "fixed stars") move also, shifting clockwise around the ecliptic as seen by the northern hemisphere. It takes 25,800 years for the points of the intersection to move all the way around the ecliptic.
Views from the earth, the universe of stars seemed to the ancients to be attached to the great "celestial sphere" which had the Earth as its center. The "celestial equator" is the projection of the earth's equator upon the inside of the sphere. The circle of the ecliptic is the path which the sun appears to follow against the background of "fixed stars." The zodiac is a belt of sky, extending 9 DEGREES above and below the ecliptic, which can be divided into twelve zones of equal size, each characterized by the presence of a particularly prominent constellation. The moon and visible planets all appear to move within the confines of the zodiacal belt. The equinoctial points are two places where the equator intersects the ecliptic, at an angle of approximately 23.5 DEGREES. Hipparchus of Rhodes discovered that the position of the equinoxes was not constant. He determined that the vernal (spring) equinox had once been in the constellation Taurus but had, by his day, moved ("precessed") almost all the way through the constellation of Aries. At the beginning of the Christian era, the vernal equinox moved into Pisces (the Fish).
When Hipparchus discovered that the vernal equinox had been displaced from Taurus into Aries, he or some of his disciples felt that they had detected the labor of a hitherto unknown god. (Many Greeks felt that each natural phenomenon or physical force was actually the working of a particular god.) For astrological reasons, this new god was identified with the ancient Persian god of Mithra (Ahura-Mazda). The mystery religion known as Mithraism thus was born, by adopting an existing god-myth of old. Mithra was installed as a Time-Lord or chronocrat, the god who would rule over the age; or Aeon; of Aries.
By the time Hipparchus and his Greek-Stoic colleagues understood that the vernal equinox had moved from Taurus into Aries, the equinox was almost out of Aries as well. Very soon it would move into Pisces, and a new Time-Lord would be needed. Just as movement of the equinox out of Taurus had been symbolized as the sacrifice of a bull, so too, the movement out of Aries would come to be symbolized by the sacrifice of a lamb. The first symbol of the new-age religion, the religion reigning in the age of Pisces, significantly, would be the fish.
What is simple is you have Greek-astrologers & Greek-scribes who worked on the Septuagint - predicating the age of the fish; a new god & god-man; and the sacrifice of the lamb symbolic of the emergence of the new god-cult. God man is a fisher of men and the sacrificial-lamb. It’s appearance [of the Christos-cult] follows the same form as the emergence of the cult of Mithra: old myths were adapted to the astrological beliefs of the Greek mystics.
The Greek synoptic gospels Mark, Mathew & Luke (Mark being the oldest & the most complete based upon the # of supposed Jesus sayings) & the much later John - are not first person accounts. They are typical impersonal mythical writings authored anonymously subscribed to a name as to suggest power and authority to the writing (and this was a common practice). The Gnostic gospels - the same - Greek mystery-cult writings anonymously authored and subscribed to an authoritative name.
Sons of gods were common to antiquity. Jesus represents nothing new. What is new is Saul of Tarsus (The Christian-cult oppressor & Jew, renamed Paul) and his masochistic interpretation of the new cult (his dogma and doctrine of faith is what is new).
G3|Genius wrote:
. . . Jesus of Nazareth.
Apparently you also need some education on this namesake appellation. I am busy right now - but will get back to you the real meaning and origin of this.
Last edited by topal63 (2006-06-26 12:09:43)