BF2S Forums Where are all the whiny peaceful "Enlightened" European now?

And many Brazilians are trying to get out of Brazil, like I said, they have different priorities.

If Mexicans were swarming down I'm sure they'd be electing someone else.
Sorry if that makes them wrong in your view.

Dilbert_X wrote:

Larssen wrote:

It still worries me that multiple european countries routinely elect far right authoritarianism to power.

Yes, democracy is great until people vote the wrong way - then its bad.

If 'thuh people" want far right authoritarianism shouldn't they have it?

No. There, I've said it.

It's a bit of a disjointed article, not shining a light on anything new either. The internal rot in the EU, if you want to call it that, has been growing for at least a decade if not longer. In the case of Poland and Hungary especially, the war in Ukraine was a godsend really. Covid too. Just as the commission was finally gearing up to do something about their corruption & rejection of the ECJ and some fundamental rights, in came Putin. Suddenly the Polish government could play hero by accepting all Ukrainian refugees and divert attention to their eastern enemy. Orban also faded into the background as there was a more important issue to deal with, again. I don't believe there would be much public patience/support for infighting in the EU considering the circumstances.

And that the EU seems rather weak in its dealing with that issue is simply more of the same. Anyone who thought it would suddenly muster a military force hasn't been paying attention. Though it should be underlined that the extensive US and UK involvement stems directly from the Budapest memorandum and the sunk cost in supporting the Ukrainians from 2014 on. The rest of continental Europe wasn't involved much at all and actually internally divided over the Ukraine issue for the longest time. Credit where it's due - Ukraine was/is able to resist thanks to US/UK support.

The future is still far too uncertain though and honestly looking bleak. A rundown of possible outcomes;

-Russia succesfully claims eastern Ukraine. The western part loses much of its industrial heartland, is economically dependent on the EU and will be swamped with weapons that could flood criminal markets. It's hard to imagine Russia can foot the bill for rebuilding all the destroyed towns/cities and the country may be plunged in prolonged economic recession or depression.

-Ukraine wins back all its territory. The cost of rebuilding will be enormous. Putin's Russia will collapse, no clue who the succesor will be or if Russia can stably survive a succession.

-Russia decides to use a nuclear weapon on Ukraine. There's no telling what will happen after. I imagine large scale cyber attacks on the Russian govt by NATO allies to destroy its digital infrastructure / communications / command & control as a possible response. Maybe boots on the ground in Ukraine too. Incredibly dangerous scenario.

-Russia wins, claims the east, deposes Zelensky and installs a puppet govt in the west. It's hard to imagine how they could pull this off, but let's consider it for the sake of a complete overview of the options. I can only imagine this turning into cold war round 2.

Last edited by Larssen (2022-11-02 10:28:28)

There's a middling chance Putin will die or be ousted.
So many depend on allegiance with him for wealth and power though, but they can see that slipping away, the knives will be out if he's removed.
Whatever happens its bad times ahead for Europe, most likely they'll have to pay to rebuild Ukraine.

Meanwhile climate change is starting to cost money, China is going to do something bad within five years, the pandemic hasn't gone away.

Not really seeing a rosy future at this point.

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-63471725

They need a venture capitalist to come in and sell off the various pieces of the kingdom in order to balance the books.

I really don't know how to feel about rising interest rates. The economist saying it is a bad thing are the same ones that started all of this trouble many years ago.

I can lists all of the reasons why a strong dollar is bad for business but it still feels very counterintuitive to me and must be perplexing to the people with low education levels.

This sometimes happens in America and people get upset too. The excuse I often here is that the pilots need a mandated amount of time in the sky with the bird and ferrying a politician is a fun thing for everyone involved while also getting their mandated hours in.

meanwhile whilst tory party in free fall plays culture wars bollocks and flirts with militarism (boris in a jet, truss with her RAF retinue, braverman and fortress britain under attack).

https://twitter.com/irvinewelsh/status/ … pn8hIhABLg

this guy actually addressing the real concerns of the majority of people.

Last edited by uziq (2022-11-03 21:59:55)

a broken clock, etc ...

you've also been talking pure nonsense here for the last decade. i don't think your unhealthy attitudes are really paying off for you.

Russia could sweep across Europe, seems I'm doing well.

lmao, they couldn't even make it to kyiv. 'sweep across europe'. i'm sure france are quaking in their bottes.

Last edited by uziq (2022-11-06 01:55:04)

https://www.lrb.co.uk/the-paper/v44/n22 … own-making

fun and pithy summary of tory party recent history with david runciman. some very funny tidbits.

Sunak was originally a Brexiteer. He confessed at the time, barely a year after he first became an MP in 2015, that it had been an agonised choice, but his primary motivation seems to have been a belief that Europe was stuck in its ways and represented the past, whereas Asia – China as well as India – was the future. Osborne, though pragmatically opposed to Brexit, also placed a big bet on China, which he and Cameron saw as a vital trading partner, with human rights concerns put to one side. Hunt was never a Brexiteer, whatever he said afterwards. He survived in May’s government despite announcing that he wanted to see a second referendum on continuing membership of the single market, which he favoured. His wife is Chinese, though he once managed to forget this and say she was Japanese.

It could mean a lot of things. An invocation of Article 5 doesn't trigger automatic war. Countries have options for response. Righteous fury is maybe justified, but maybe avoid global thermonuclear war over two border casualties because Russia has drunken missiles.

Even if it (or something like it) came from a haywire Ukrainian counterbattery or missile interception or whatever, I feel like blame can still be squarely fixed on Russia for even being there or launching an attack where it can affect things over the border.