[MW2]What are your feelings on this? (Spoilers)

2009-10-29 04:54:53

#1

henno13: A generally unremarkable member; +230|6566|Belfast

Now in english and I doubt that Activision will pull this one since there is a shit laod of leaked stuff on youtube ranging from the ending to dual wielding P90s.

I was wrong...........

Spoiler (highlight to read):
In this mission, you are an undercover CIA agent a US Army Ranger who was recruited by the CIA to work inside Vladimir Makarov's inner circle. This is the scene from the previous trailers which shows terrorists walking through a Russian airport terminal and shooting anything that moves and later the FSB raid. The only real spoiler here is that you are the one that is actually doing walking through the airport killing the civilians.

I really don't know how to feel. A very small part of me says that it is disgusting and horrorific, while the rest of me is saying that its just a videogame and there are no morals involved, which is true. IW have said that there are two checkpoints that warn you of upcomming disturbing scenes and it allows you to skip the level. I will be playing it anyway. Its good that someone has the balls to actually do a scene like this. A massive media shitstorm will inevitably come as result of this. I guess that this was one of the reason why it was rated 18.

Discuss.

Last edited by henno13 (2009-11-01 14:29:51)

2009-10-29 05:00:37

#2

AussieReaper: ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°); +5,761|6370|what

There's no challenge at all in shooting unarmed civilians with an RPD.

It's a pointless exercise designed to shock.

I think it is sick and distasteful and that it's a desperate attempt by Infinity Ward to purposely push the boundary for nothing more than the sake of saying they did so.

Click on my sig's right image to read what I think of the latest Modern Warfare game.

Last edited by AussieReaper (2009-10-29 05:03:16)

2009-10-29 05:10:01

#3

Nintendogamer: Member; +72|6805|Chelmsford, UK

some "concerned" parents will no doubt write to the sun saying how they wont buy it for their 8 year old son.

as for the game itself, well its a game, fallout 3 is worse for civillian killing and violence.

2009-10-29 05:18:03

#4

Doctor Strangelove: Real Battlefield Veterinarian.; +1,758|6686

You killed people in all the other Call of Duty games.

IW is just trying to make the game controversial, that way our news and its integrity will talk about the game, and people will buy the game to see what all the buzz is about. Also I heard somewhere that this scene was based off the Mumbia attacks, if the media actually manages to gain enough intelligence to make that conclusion, it'd be even more controversial.

But like I said, you kill people in other Call of Duty games, this isn't to special.

But also, this scene seems to talk place in Russia. CoD4 taught me that Russians don't have souls so it is okay to kill them.

2009-10-29 05:22:42

#5

FEOS: Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate; +1,182|6628|'Murka

I don't see how there are balls involved in doing that. It's pointless. If IW wanted to immerse the player in the horror of the scene, make it a cutscene rather than full-on participation in the slaughter of unarmed civilians. I suppose that seeing it absent the overall context of the game, it's unfair to make a judgment call, but I am challenged to think of a context where it would be acceptable or make sense.

“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular

2009-10-29 06:08:30

#6

AussieReaper: ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°); +5,761|6370|what

Australia’s Classification Board defended its decision to give the game an MA15+ rating by commenting on the scene: “Several civilians are shot with blood burst bullet wounds; civilian corpses are strewn across the airport floor, often in stylised pools of blood; injured civilians crawl away with lengthy blood trails behind them.”

It further noted that no post-mortem damage may be inflicted on the corpses, and that killing civilians at any other point during the game results in mission failure.

Nicholas Suzor, a spokesman for Electronic Frontiers Australia, a lobby group for game developers and software producers stated that games like Modern Warfare 2 highlighted a need for an R18+ rating for video games in the country. At the present, games that exceed the rating of M15+ are denied classification and effectively banned from retail.

Suzor argued, “Films often show the villain's perspective and, by doing that, they get across the character's story and the heinous nature of people who carry out atrocities. Games, too, are becoming more expressive, and are telling more involved stories.

“We may make an argument that these sorts of topics are not suitable for children, but I don't at all accept that it is unsuitable for adults.”

A spokesman for the Classification Board said to Sydney Morning Herald that it would not be reviewing its decision to rate the game and that anyone who wanted to request a review would have to make an application through the proper channels.

Source

This leaked footage is not going to change the fact the game is rated M15+ here, despite some protest from civil groups.

I'm not sure how other countries will handle the airport massacre. Australia is generally pretty tough against this sort of thing.

2009-10-29 06:13:19

#7

FEOS: Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate; +1,182|6628|'Murka

I guess I'm less bothered by the notion of participating in the massacre (as a terrorist in the story) than by the notion that you are a CIA agent participating in the massacre. Preventing that massacre would be a threshold event for burning your cover. Again, I guess the overall context is important as to why they chose to go that way in the storyline.

“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular

2009-10-29 06:17:03

#8

Flecco: iPod is broken.; +1,048|6882|NT, like Mick Dundee

Retarded addition.

Seriously, what the fuck. What a boring level from a gameplay point of view, shooting people isn't exactly new in video games. Shooting unarmed people isn't new. From what I saw the player seems forced to spend most of the level walking and has the choice of whether to actually shoot anybody or not. There are no children or infants (which really could have raised some eyebrows and given people pause for thought). In essence, using mob AI they degenerate what could be effective if done on a small scale into a horde-like mass of moving pixels which evoke little emotional reaction. They aren't pushing an envelope, they are making a shitty uninformed design decision. About as deep as a teaspoon, with about as much original content too.

If they wanted to push moral envelopes in video gaming and pose real questions about ethics there are far, far better ways to go about it. Grand Theft Auto 4 was more mature than this, and that's not saying much given the presence of BDSM in the intro movie for no other reason than to make people laugh/be shocked.

Whoa... Can't believe these forums are still kicking.

2009-10-29 06:49:34

#9

Mekstizzle: WALKER; +3,611|6838|London, England

I remember reading somewhere that you're actually a CIA undercover guy who does this, which adds a whole nother dimension to the idea of actually "doing terrorisms"

Also I heard somewhere that this scene was based off the Mumbia attacks, if the media actually manages to gain enough intelligence to make that conclusion, it'd be even more controversial.

It does have some big similarities with those attacks tbh. I wouldn't be surprised if this game gets banned in India, and Brazil because of this. I think it's a Brazilian airport they shoot up right? It's definitely not an American airport. They wouldn't dare doing that, it's all somehow ok to shoot up a foreign airport though. Oh wait it's Russian, I guess that makes it even easier to just kill whoever you see!

You can kill civilians in loads of games, but I don't think alot of games have actual missions where the intent is to kill civilians for actual terror purposes. It is pushing it alot.

Last edited by Mekstizzle (2009-10-29 06:53:00)

2009-10-29 07:49:13

#10

M.O.A.B: 'Light 'em up!'; +1,220|6440|Escea

Game's a game. They're only pixelated characters after all, not exactly real civilians. Stuff like GTA is far worse, seeing as you spend the entire game mowing down innocents or hacking into them with a chainsaw. I could imagine that if it were turned into a cutscene, people would be complaining that they couldn't play it. I originally had an idea from the old teaser trailer, where you heard them loading up in the lift, heard the tannoy, and then the shooting started, that it might be a level.

There are security guards and police on that level as well, so its not just unarmed people.
Still, a game is a game. Not reality.

2009-10-29 10:58:54

#11

SplinterStrike: Roamer; +250|6628|Eskimo land. AKA Canada.

Video is French, so I'll do my best to translate what they're saying.

Intro
The rest of the task force *undecipherable*

Two men eliminated an entire base, I will ask even more of you.

Yesterday you were soldiers on the front lines. Today, the front lines are the past, uniforms too. War is being played everywhere, and there will be victims.

Makarov fights for himself, and obeys no laws. He has no limits, and will back down from nothing. Torture, trafficking, murder or genocide. He isn't hampered by ideals, respects no flags or countries. He trades blood for money. He's also our new best friend. I wont tell you what it cost to get you close to him. (best guess translation for this bit ->) It might just cost you your sanity, which is nothing compared to everything you'll save.
*game starts*

God protect us. Don't forget, leave no Russians alive.

- Comment around 2:47
Made him bleed, go.

4:43
We're going.

Police sirens sound off in the background. (5:20)
They're right on time. Check your weapons and ammo.

I've been waiting for this for a long time.
Just like all of us.

- Kicks in door (5:35)
Let's go.

5:49
Go Zakayesh(I think)
It's the FSB! (Thanks Henno) Take them down!

During the fighting, there's too many so I won't bother with the timestamps.

Go, go!
I'm moving!
I've secured the landing strip!
I'm ready!
Move, move!
Go!
I'm going, cover me.
Contact, first floor!
Go go go!
FSB van!
Move it.
I'm ready.
Move it!

7:43
He's dead, leave him.
Hallway clear.

8:18
Cease fire.
We're going to leave a nice message with this attack Makarov.
I don't call that a message. *caps you* Thats a message.

The Americans thought they could get us. When they find your corpse, all of Russia will want war.

That's about the best I can do considering the video quality. Hope it helps some of you

Last edited by SplinterStrike (2009-10-29 13:06:46)

2009-10-29 11:50:47

#12

henno13: A generally unremarkable member; +230|6566|Belfast

SplinterStrike wrote:
...

Thanks

Btw, the name of the police force that raids the terminal is the Russian Federal Security Service, commonly known as the FSB.

+1

Last edited by henno13 (2009-10-29 11:54:06)

2009-10-29 11:54:29

#13

SEREMAKER: BABYMAKIN EXPERT √; +2,187|6786|Mountains of NC

Gta

https://static.bf2s.com/files/user/17445/carhartt.jpg

2009-10-29 12:05:40

#14

M.O.A.B: 'Light 'em up!'; +1,220|6440|Escea

henno13 wrote:
SplinterStrike wrote:
...
Thanks

Btw, the name of the police force that raids the terminal is the Russian Federal Security Service, commonly known as the FSB.

+1

They look like the same ones in 'The Rock' style shower screenie as well. With the riot shields.

2009-10-29 12:19:00

#15

csmag: Member; +92|6664|Canada

Who cares, weve all done it in gta anyways.

2009-10-29 12:24:33

#16

aerodynamic: FOCKING HELL; +241|5971|Roma

csmag wrote:
Who cares, weve all done it in gta anyways.

exactly.
Even driving fast and accidently killing a civilian is what?..normal?

jeez what a big deal.

https://bf3s.com/sigs/8ea27f2d75b353b0a18b096ed75ec5e142da7cc2.png

2009-10-29 12:25:56

#17

Miggle: FUCK UBISOFT; +1,411|6959|FUCK UBISOFT

csmag wrote:
Who cares, weve all done it in real life anyways.

2009-10-29 12:30:41

#18

Finray: Hup! Dos, Tres, Cuatro; +2,629|6006|Catherine Black

aerodynamic wrote:
csmag wrote:
Who cares, weve all done it in gta anyways.
exactly.
Even driving fast and accidently killing a civilian is what?..normal?

jeez what a big deal.

The difference being GTA isn't looked upon as a realistic shooter. It's a game in which you rampage about the streets killing innocents. It's always been like that, every since GTA 1.

MW2 is being passed as a very serious-faced almost simulation shooter.

2009-10-29 12:31:59

#19

Miggle: FUCK UBISOFT; +1,411|6959|FUCK UBISOFT

Finray wrote:
aerodynamic wrote:
csmag wrote:
Who cares, weve all done it in gta anyways.
exactly.
Even driving fast and accidently killing a civilian is what?..normal?

jeez what a big deal.
The difference being GTA isn't looked upon as a realistic shooter. It's a game in which you rampage about the streets killing innocents. It's always been like that, every since GTA 1.

MW2 is being passed as a very serious-faced almost simulation shooter.

I laughed.

2009-10-29 12:43:20

#20

Finray: Hup! Dos, Tres, Cuatro; +2,629|6006|Catherine Black

Miggle wrote:
Finray wrote:
aerodynamic wrote:

exactly.
Even driving fast and accidently killing a civilian is what?..normal?

jeez what a big deal.
The difference being GTA isn't looked upon as a realistic shooter. It's a game in which you rampage about the streets killing innocents. It's always been like that, every since GTA 1.

MW2 is being passed as a very serious-faced almost simulation shooter.
I laughed.

Maybe not to that extent, I'll grant you, but the games are poles apart.

2009-10-29 13:57:52

#21

Hallvard: Member; +263|6740|North Norway

I see no problems with it...
Don't really see why anyone would have a problem with it... Unless you're of the bunch of watch the world in black and white and believe in such things as "good" and "evil"

2009-10-29 14:03:23

#22

aerodynamic: FOCKING HELL; +241|5971|Roma

Finray wrote:
Miggle wrote:
Finray wrote:

The difference being GTA isn't looked upon as a realistic shooter. It's a game in which you rampage about the streets killing innocents. It's always been like that, every since GTA 1.

MW2 is being passed as a very serious-faced almost simulation shooter.
I laughed.
Maybe not to that extent, I'll grant you, but the games are poles apart.

You are taking out the fact that this is a video game we are talking about.
The civilians are not real, their pixels.
And i do not see any difference between killing civilians and in GTA4 and MW2.
MW2 a simulation shooter? don't think so.

2009-10-29 14:13:47

#23

Mekstizzle: WALKER; +3,611|6838|London, England

I think the difference is that you're not actually supposed to kill civilians in GTA, it's just that you can if you want.

Also reading the English translation that guy posted up there it seems they eventually find out you're an American spy working undercover for them (I didn't watch the whole video) and then they kill you and leave you as evidence for Russian authorities that the attack was infact done by Americans. Which leads to the whole of Russia presumably declaring war on the US or at least a massive boost for the "ultranationalist" faction that was in CoD 4, and hence why in the trailer you got DC on fire. Pretty interesting storyline to be honest. It's just a game.

2009-10-29 14:19:34

#24

M.O.A.B: 'Light 'em up!'; +1,220|6440|Escea

Wonder if Jack Thompson has seen it yet lol.

2009-10-29 16:16:36

#25

jaymz9350: Member; +54|6794

AussieReaper wrote:
I think it is sick and distasteful and that it's a desperate attempt by Infinity Ward to purposely push the boundary for nothing more than the sake of saying they did so.

That's pretty much the the only reason any game pushes the envelope.

BF2S Forums [MW2]What are your feelings on this? (Spoilers)

SplinterStrike wrote:

henno13 wrote:

SplinterStrike wrote:

csmag wrote:

csmag wrote:

aerodynamic wrote:

csmag wrote:

Finray wrote:

aerodynamic wrote:

csmag wrote:

Miggle wrote:

Finray wrote:

aerodynamic wrote:

Finray wrote:

Miggle wrote:

Finray wrote:

AussieReaper wrote:

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